@lakerie

oh I agree Lake kinda like when democrats show up at black churches when it’s election time. Both sides are disgusting when they play politics and use GOD doing it.

Posted by: @lakerie

I have to admit that I wasn’t entirely clear on what “defunding the police “ meant. I thought it was the complete disbanding of local police departments through $0 budget. As the term gets put out there more, it has been better explained. As I understand it now, it means no additional funding or a drastic reduction in funding with those funds that would have been applied to police would go to social programs. Either way I’m not a fan of it. We need our police and if anything, funding is needed for psychological vetting of applicants and effective non lethal training...not military gear.

Roam, you mentioned the Koch’s twice. Read Kochland by Christopher Leonard, it’s an interesting read. They are not nice people though brilliant businessman.

Yeah, I know the Kochs are pretty bad. That was actually the reason I posted it... Basically the Kochs are huge conservatives and if even they think police militarization is out of control, it's probably an issue. LOL.

Posted by: @lakerie

Southern, I would argue that many citizens of color in this country might disagree that things are better. And if you meant by getting rid of the government we have now means getting rid of a government that tear gasses a peaceful protest for a phony photo op and with a bible no less, says to the police don't be so gentle, dominate protestors, some very fine people on both sides in Charlottesville and any star can grab a pussy, then I don't agree. I would agree that unless we find real leadership, we very well could be living under the Russian or Chinese flag (note..the last was a highly exaggerated statement). I do agree we could use more spirituality and I'm alarmed with rising numbers of atheists/agnostics within they younger generations. 

I feel we have to better define the separation of church and state in this country. Religion and spirituality belongs to the individual, to guide them on their personal journey and help them when they need it. It has no business in our government, but I have nothing against our leaders having and using their faith to guide them personally in their decisions while serving in government positions. To me, there is a big difference.

Personally, I don't feel "In God we Trust" should be on our money, I don't feel courts should use a bible (rather use a law book) to swear in on, and the phrase "under God" should be removed from the pledge of allegiance (It was only added in the 50s anyway). Also, the official motto of the United States should be E Pluribus Unum, which was what the founding fathers intended. Their mistake was not codifying it into law, which gave Congress the oppurtunity to make "In God we Trust" the official motto in the 1950's.

The country was founded on the fundamental principal that a King appointed by God did not have the right to determine our lives, but we ourselves do. It's exactly why the set up our new form of government, and made separation of church from the state such a big deal. These were very religious men as well, but they saw the wisdom in keeping things separate.

Southern, you are absolutely right, Dems find political opportunities as well

Roam, the Koch brothers are fundamental Libertarians...absolute hands off government control and regulations, no taxes. They founded a business cult of their own called Market Base Management. Also, per your thoughts I am completely for separation of church and state. 

Poking around for some statistics.

I did some time as a foster parent in an area where the children were 90 plus percent black. 

Some statistics, they may not be precise but I'm trying to be intellectually honest:

Posted by: @underlion

Poking around for some statistics.

I did some time as a foster parent in an area where the children were 90 plus percent black. 

Some statistics, they may not be precise but I'm trying to be intellectually honest:

 

Foster kids

80% of inmates have spent time in the foster system

50% will be homeless within 18 months of leaving care (not sure if that is aging out at 18)

60% will earn incomes below the poverty level

65% experience 7 or more school changes

1-3% graduate college

81% will be arrested vs 17% of peers

 

 

Kids with no dad (all ethnicities)

5x more likely to be poor and commit crimes

9x more likely to drop out of school

20x more likely to go to jail

 

1965 25% black children born out of Wedlock now 75%

1965 5% white children born out of wedlock now 25%

 

So the biased media will state the statistics showing blacks are jailed at a higher ratio then whites with the implication that the crimes are not commited or the justice system is not fair but the statistics above explain much of the gap.

 

2017 12% of population was black and 33% of prisoners 

2017 64% of population was white and 30% of prisoners

 

So to a large degree the prison percentage is the same with 5x as many whites in the population.  You might say out of wedlock children account for 60% of the 5x.  But then if kids without dads are 5x more likely to comit crimes then difference is quickly explained?

 

So if 33% of prisoners are black and 30% are white one might assume that the police interactions are similar in number?  If so how many blacks are killed by cops vs whites?

 

Data I see has 400 whites vs 225 blacks killed by cops each year, rough average for the prior three years (data from statista).  So whites get killed by cops at a higher ratio to incarcerations than blacks.  Interesting, maybe statistically significant if my numbers are good at all.

 

I don't see data on blacks vs whites in the foster system but it would be fair to guess it is similar to the out of wedlock % multiplied by the population ratio.

 

My data above doesn't support a social injustice argument but the data the media is showing, simple incarceration rates makes things look bad.  Because they already have the why answer they don't ask any further questions.

 

The risk factors that add up:

-not having a dad (real not sperm donor)

-education

Both lead to poverty

 

Let me be perfectly clear.  I'm not saying racism doesn't exist.  I've had black friends since I was 8.  Sometimes my best friend has been black.  Small sample but i know too many of them have been pulled over/detained without real cause.  In my 55 years I have never been pulled over that i didn't deserve it.  But when trying to fix problems I'm  used to looking at data and root cause and pareto analysis.  I propose we are avoiding the 20% of the causes that create 80% of the problems.

 

Cops, say I know 20, 1 has a power/control issue and shouldn't be a cop, for argument say one is a racist.  That would suggest I have half the chance of being mistreated by a cop as my black equivalent...all things being equal.  Am I surprised to find out the Minneapolis cop had a history?  Not at all, i speculated such the first time i saw the video.  So we can make improvements. 

 

Even talking about this subject gets me flamed but us old guys lose our filter and i learn when people disagree with me.

 

I take some pride in the fact that PSU can claim some leadership in this subject (Triplett and graduation rate of black athletes).

 

 

"-not having a dad (real not sperm donor)
-education
Both lead to poverty"

Generally speaking the black community is already in poverty, those things aren't leading to poverty but are symptoms of it. They aren't causing their issues, they are the result of the issues. Go look at the statistics for poor people who are white, and you'll be amazed at how they start to look very similar to the black statistics you just showed.

In the early to mid 1900's blacks in this country were so completely effed, with major portions of their community being left with nothing. Whites were given loans to home ownership, loans to start small businesses, and jobs to build income that would grow into the strong middle class which provided the next generation with ample opportunities to make more money and have more success. Blacks were redlined, locked out from loans, and left without viable help to grow and create opportunities for themselves. When a black community actually did rise up and become a success story, such as in Greenwood (Tulsa), white people decided to burn 35 blocks of it down and kill a bunch of them.

Of course I'm not saying white people should feel guilt for this, I wasn't alive then and neither were a lot of other people. But we should acknowledge it as a reason blacks are so disenfranchised and poor today. They were playing against a stacked deck for years, and a playing catch up now. Sure, we integrated schools in the 60s and 70s, but by then the damage was done. Blacks missed the boat on the middle class, they didn't have the oppurtunity to build that wealth like whites did. Another big factor is the policy shifts of the late 70s, 80s, and 90s, when politics shifted and the middle class began to shrink. Upwards mobility went down, and more of a gap between the haves and have-nots grew. ...aaaaannnnnnnddddd who at that point was starting from way in the back? You guessed it, the black community.

Of course this is just my opinion on it, it's such a complex issue. Mainly though I feel a lot of the problems the black community has now are socio-economic, as a result of years and years of being denied financial oppurtunity. While I believe those opportunities do exist for them now, they are hampered by the situation past grievances have put them in.

Just my two cents. I think these things are important to talk about, and have conversations with people about. It's good to know the views of others with as little judgement as possible, if we aren't able to converse civilly about important issues they never get solved.

...All that said...

Man who can't wait for football to come back so we can talk about less heavy things? I miss the escape of more trivial discussion...

All I got to say is “don’t let ANY man deceive you”!!!!! If you do life might not be all that good regardless of who you are. 

I am just a simple funeral director. I spend a great deal of time in churches, Synagogues, Temples, Mosques, Cathedrals and any other religious site you can think of overseeing the funerals of people of every color and religion imaginable. I have come to some conclusions. We are all more or less looking for the same things in life. All religions believe the same fundamental beliefs and the religious issues of our time are the result of zealots that bastardize whatever religion it is that they belong to. It boils down to this.....

Treat everybody as u would want to be treated

Put yourself in the other persons shoes

Be kind to people

To me if everybody followed those 3 simple things there would be a lot less problems, strife and heartache in this world....

@the-funeral-director

FD my man,  you know the ole saying, you shall hear the truth and it will piss you off lol....I still believe if somebody gets upset about JESUS or fake religions and politics it’s because they have no confidence in what they believe in. People just trip me out baby lol