Roam, Clemson probably gets better players out of Georgia than they do South Carolina. They recruit hard in Georgia. Just a guess I can’t prove anything.
Why exactly was this kid a "must get"? I mean, from a logistical standpoint he has a much better chance to start right away at OSU. We have loads of talent at WR... He wasn't a "must get".
What we need is to beat Ohio State, MSU, and Michigan. We do that and recruiting will sort itself. I have no idea why people think one kid makes or breaks everything. And a WR at that... a position we are absolutely stocked at.
I will say this... If we beat Ohio State and win the Big Ten this year, or if Justin Fields struggles considerably in the passing game, don't be surprised if Fleming reevaluates his decision.
................................hmmmm....nah. Hartline is why he went to OSU. Period
Could be, but I'm thinking 3 WR coaches in 3 years sure didnt help. But whatever, we're stacked at WR and I wish the kid the best. The one that I hated to see go was Bressee.
Looking at it from a historical perspective, there's little doubt the top 8 programs in college football, so called tier 1 blueblood programs....are Alabama, Michigan, Nebraska, Notre Dame, Ohio St, Oklahoma, USC, Texas..
After that, the arguments begin..
LOL...Nebraska, USC and Texas???lmao...man...they aint been anywhere last few years. USC dominance died in 2012, Texas hasn't been great since 2011, Nebraska???? 2001 was their last decent season.
Looking at it from a historical perspective, there's little doubt the top 8 programs in college football, so called tier 1 blueblood programs....are Alabama, Michigan, Nebraska, Notre Dame, Ohio St, Oklahoma, USC, Texas..
After that, the arguments begin..
LOL...Nebraska, USC and Texas???lmao...man...they aint been anywhere last few years. USC dominance died in 2012, Texas hasn't been great since 2011, Nebraska???? 2001 was their last decent season.
Right on Bill. Also, how long has it been since "shake down the thunder...."?
Some here need a reading comprehension course ...I said "historically" not June 3rd 2019, not the 2018 season, but "historically" These 8 have been America's top programs historically..Every school, even Alabama has down years, see Dennis Franchione, Mike Debose, Mike Shula...Most of college football success is coaching related, finding the right guy. Bama did with Nick Saban Short of Dabo Swinney taking Saban's job, they will have down years again...LOok at Oklahoma coaching records before Bob Stoops, many a down yr, same at ND, UM, OSU...that's the nature of the game
The constant is these 8 have accomplished more than anyone and will always be in the conversation with all 8 capable of a national title..Texas, for example is already on way back, beating UGA in Sugar Bowl, and OKlahoma in regular season behind Tom Herman..Someone mentioned USC..A short two yrs ago, 2017 season, USC was a popular choice to win nat'l title, roster was stacked USC may have coaching problems, time will tell if Clay Helton can get it done, many USC followers don't think so...but USC will always be a natl power, talent wise..Just a matter of time before they are back..Nebraska may have toughest road back, but I think Scott Frost can make great headway..
Some here need a reading comprehension course ...I said "historically" not June 3rd 2019, not the 2018 season, but "historically" These 8 have been America's top programs historically..Every school, even Alabama has down years, see Dennis Franchione, Mike Debose, Mike Shula...Most of college football success is coaching related, finding the right guy. Bama did with Nick Saban Short of Dabo Swinney taking Saban's job, they will have down years again...LOok at Oklahoma coaching records before Bob Stoops, many a down yr, same at ND, UM, OSU...that's the nature of the game
The constant is these 8 have accomplished more than anyone and will always be in the conversation with all 8 capable of a national title..Texas, for example is already on way back, beating UGA in Sugar Bowl, and OKlahoma in regular season behind Tom Herman..Someone mentioned USC..A short two yrs ago, 2017 season, USC was a popular choice to win nat'l title, roster was stacked USC may have coaching problems, time will tell if Clay Helton can get it done, many USC followers don't think so...but USC will always be a natl power, talent wise..Just a matter of time before they are back..Nebraska may have toughest road back, but I think Scott Frost can make great headway..
Historically, there are several teams that USED to be good....not any more. What does history have to do with current? Not a thing for the teams I mentioned, and that's what we're talking about, current. USC may have been picked to be good.....but wasn't.
Some here need a reading comprehension course ...I said "historically" not June 3rd 2019, not the 2018 season, but "historically" These 8 have been America's top programs historically..Every school, even Alabama has down years, see Dennis Franchione, Mike Debose, Mike Shula...Most of college football success is coaching related, finding the right guy. Bama did with Nick Saban Short of Dabo Swinney taking Saban's job, they will have down years again...LOok at Oklahoma coaching records before Bob Stoops, many a down yr, same at ND, UM, OSU...that's the nature of the game
The constant is these 8 have accomplished more than anyone and will always be in the conversation with all 8 capable of a national title..Texas, for example is already on way back, beating UGA in Sugar Bowl, and OKlahoma in regular season behind Tom Herman..Someone mentioned USC..A short two yrs ago, 2017 season, USC was a popular choice to win nat'l title, roster was stacked USC may have coaching problems, time will tell if Clay Helton can get it done, many USC followers don't think so...but USC will always be a natl power, talent wise..Just a matter of time before they are back..Nebraska may have toughest road back, but I think Scott Frost can make great headway..
Historically, there are several teams that USED to be good....not any more. What does history have to do with current? Not a thing for the teams I mentioned, and that's what we're talking about, current. USC may have been picked to be good.....but wasn't.
Bill, it's pretty clear that CT was adding to to the post "Penn state was never recognized as a top tier program" and the others who responded to it. So yeah, they were talking about historically elite programs, not just ones that are good today.
Could be, but I'm thinking 3 WR coaches in 3 years sure didnt help. But whatever, we're stacked at WR and I wish the kid the best. The one that I hated to see go was Bressee.
There are no certainty in the assistant coach ranks... OSU WR coach could jump to an OC job if offered, point is that he could see 3 coaches in three or four years. It happens.
AS I said southern, let the arguments begin for no. 9..You make a strong argument for no. 9, Id have no problem with PSU at no.9, FSU Seminole fans may disagree with that, 2-3 natl titles, and maybe an unprecedented number of consecutive top 5 finishes to their favor; Gator fans with 3 natl titles, a long history of success, and maybe even Miami Hurricane fans, albeit a short run in history, 5 national titles, and maybe 2-3 runnersup in that same time span....
He who wins the most games is #1 brother all the NC’s is just somebody’s opinions 😁 and the last 50 years we know who did that
He who wins the most games is #1 brother all the NC’s is just somebody’s opinions 😁 and the last 50 years we know who did that
Disagree with that Southern. Simply winning the most games doesn't make you #1. My point being Michigan is not the best football program in history... far from it.
Then what does? Joe for 50 years won big time bowl games, won the most bowl games against stiff competition, won NC’s had 5 undefeated seasons and won the most games. Add all dat up and IMO puts penn st at #1 plus did it playing by the rules and graduating football players at a high rate. Don’t get no better than that. Everything I just named is done accomplished on the field even the NC’s.BTW I do agree with you about Michigan.
I’m sorry in the 70’s and 80’s nobody cared anything about Ohio st and Michigan except their fans. The big 10 stunk and until Penn State joined it was garbage and got little respect but I still consider them part of the big dawg family because if they have the right coach they have a chance to win a NC. I have recently added Clemson to the big dawgs because they’ve earned it. Alabama, LSU, Florida, Auburn, Bullpups, Tennessee, Texas, Oklahoma, ND, USC, Florida State, Miami, Clemson, Nebraska, Ohio State, Michigan and Penn State are the cream of the crop. Nebraska is hanging on by a thread staying in the big dawg family but they still deserve to be in because they have had great success on the field let’s hope frost can get it turned around which I think he will. I do have the Bullpups in because we all know their talent is really 2nd to nobody except maybe the Tide.
Then what does? Joe for 50 years won big time bowl games, won the most bowl games against stiff competition, won NC’s had 5 undefeated seasons and won the most games. Add all dat up and IMO puts penn st at #1 plus did it playing by the rules and graduating football players at a high rate. Don’t get no better than that. Everything I just named is done accomplished on the field even the NC’s.BTW I do agree with you about Michigan.
You're proving my point Southern... you keep saying "no one cared about Michigan" and basically discounting them but they have the most wins in college football history. If you are going to say winning the most games makes you #1, then Michigan is the best program in history.
I will say that you added a bunch to just"winning games" in your last post though... Most bowl games, most undefeated season, etc. etc. etc.
I'm just saying it's not as simple as "He who wins the most games is #1 brother ". It matters who you beat, when you beat them, what your record was in big games, etc.
Look, I love Paterno but I don't consider him the best ever just because he won 409. There are others who won more big games and more national titles. Those matter too.
I believe winning the most bowl games and having 5 undefeated seasons makes him the best coach plus he won the most games. Only coach to win all 4 major bowls. He won a lot of big time bowl games. All of joes accomplishments were done on the field not somebody’s opinions. All the other coaches had the same opportunity but didn’t get it done. It’s just my opinion though just like it was most everybody else’s before the bogus scandal. I’m talking about the last 50 years when joe started coaching
According to The Athletic, Fleming was concerned with the way that Shorter was treated. Forgetting all of the injuries, Fleming focused on the lack of PT for Shorter.
“I did see that throughout the year, and I didn’t agree with it,” Fleming said. “You gotta play your best players, and obviously he’s a freak. He’s 6-3, 6-4, 215 and they just didn’t utilize him whatsoever, so that was one of the big things I thought about. It kind of took its toll a little bit with the No. 1 kid going in and not really playing at all.”
According to The Athletic, Fleming was concerned with the way that Shorter was treated. Forgetting all of the injuries, Fleming focused on the lack of PT for Shorter.
“I did see that throughout the year, and I didn’t agree with it,” Fleming said. “You gotta play your best players, and obviously he’s a freak. He’s 6-3, 6-4, 215 and they just didn’t utilize him whatsoever, so that was one of the big things I thought about. It kind of took its toll a little bit with the No. 1 kid going in and not really playing at all.”
Flemming really has no clue as to why Shorter was not playing... His ignorance to Shorter's injury and recovery shows not ability to rationalize what was going on... Why would a coaching staff waste a season for a player when they can give them a full healthy season to show what he can do. Shorter will be better of for it.
Which is why I do not feel this a big loss, other than it makes "Dominate the State" sound hollow. Fleming needs to live life on life's terms, not his terms.
Roam, I believe the big 3 are the Bear, the great Bobby Bowdon and the greatest Joe Paterno but I also think Barry Switzer belongs up there as well. Switzer really doesn’t get the credit he deserves IMO I guess probably because of all the trouble his players got into. Them 4 are the top 4 IMO. Man, them Oklahoma teams were good under Switzer
According to The Athletic, Fleming was concerned with the way that Shorter was treated. Forgetting all of the injuries, Fleming focused on the lack of PT for Shorter.
“I did see that throughout the year, and I didn’t agree with it,” Fleming said. “You gotta play your best players, and obviously he’s a freak. He’s 6-3, 6-4, 215 and they just didn’t utilize him whatsoever, so that was one of the big things I thought about. It kind of took its toll a little bit with the No. 1 kid going in and not really playing at all.”
Shows the mentality of many kids today: "I have no idea what the situation was other than I think he's the best... so he should play"
Even if Shorter was completely healthy, that doesn't mean he's the best. Yeah, he was ranked the #1 WR in the recruiting class. SO WHAT. That doesn't mean he'll be successful in college, the list of top recruits who don't make it is long.
