@psuinhawaii. Yes and remember ken Norton hurt Holmes as well and Holmes recovered and won that fight. Larry Holmes was tough and he could take a punch that’s why he won 48 straight fights he was just to old there at the end to get 49. When Holmes was in his prime they threw everything they had at him but nobody could beat him until he was just to old to compete against great young fighters. That’s why I have Larry Holmes at #2 behind Mayweather because unlike Ali, joe, Spinks, iron mike, George, the real deal, Lewis, Norton and all the other great fighters Larry didn’t lose why he was in his prime nobody rained on his parade until he got old. 60’s-90’s boxing was one brutal tough sport and Larry was the best because he didn’t lose while he was young in his prime.
I would really have to think hard to who I think the top 5 pound for pound boxers of all time were. I may put Holmes in there. He was a masterful boxer for his weight. My only knock which isn’t his fault of course is that when he was in his prime there was no real what I’d call quality competition. I think his toughest competition was that fight where he won the title against Norton. That fight was fricking awesome too. Two guys that big still punching each other toe to toe at the end of the 15th round...classic old school boxing. And speaking of Norton, yes I totally agree that he beat Ali all 3 fights.
Personally, I am not a fan of Ali... mainly after reading, watching, and otherwise learning about his treatment of Malcolm X, Joe Frazier, and countless others.
Everyone says he was so courageous for refusing to go to the Vietnam war, yet fails to mention his cowardice in turning his back on Malcom X when he stood up for what was right. Completely shunned him after calling him a friend, just let the Muslim Brotherhood tell him what to do. All because Malcom X dared to say blacks and whites could live together in harmony, and that they shouldn't be preaching segregation.
Also, he was a loudmouth fool who continually disrespected Joe Frazier, even after Frazier put his own career on the line to get Ali reinstated. I mean, Ali would show up to charity events where Frazier was working with kids in Philly to talk smack. WITH KIDS IN HIS HOMETOWN.
Ali was a certifiable a$$ho@#
Roam all that is true and I have to admit, I didn't like his cockiness while in his prime. That said, my wife and I met him and his second wife at the USAir club at the old Pittsburgh airport. Ali and wife Lonnie could not have been friendlier and more entertaining. Everyone in the room wanted to meet him and of of course he accomadated everyone. You could tell he wasnt' the same person, talking a little slower and trembling, the blows to the head had taken their toll. We laughed when he asked my wife..."you married to him? You can do way better than that!". But he would tell jokes, do his missing finger magic trick, laugh and just generally clown around with a warm and inviting smile.
This is my personal experience with Ali and I'm grateful for it. In my opinion much of his antics were to bring attention to himself which he did very well...good and bad.
Personally, I am not a fan of Ali... mainly after reading, watching, and otherwise learning about his treatment of Malcolm X, Joe Frazier, and countless others.
Everyone says he was so courageous for refusing to go to the Vietnam war, yet fails to mention his cowardice in turning his back on Malcom X when he stood up for what was right. Completely shunned him after calling him a friend, just let the Muslim Brotherhood tell him what to do. All because Malcom X dared to say blacks and whites could live together in harmony, and that they shouldn't be preaching segregation.
Also, he was a loudmouth fool who continually disrespected Joe Frazier, even after Frazier put his own career on the line to get Ali reinstated. I mean, Ali would show up to charity events where Frazier was working with kids in Philly to talk smack. WITH KIDS IN HIS HOMETOWN.
Ali was a certifiable a$$ho@#
Roam all that is true and I have to admit, I didn't like his cockiness while in his prime. That said, my wife and I met him and his second wife at the USAir club at the old Pittsburgh airport. Ali and wife Lonnie could not have been friendlier and more entertaining. Everyone in the room wanted to meet him and of of course he accomadated everyone. You could tell he wasnt' the same person, talking a little slower and trembling, the blows to the head had taken their toll. We laughed when he asked my wife..."you married to him? You can do way better than that!". But he would tell jokes, do his missing finger magic trick, laugh and just generally clown around with a warm and inviting smile.
This is my personal experience with Ali and I'm grateful for it. In my opinion much of his antics were to bring attention to himself which he did very well...good and bad.
I don't doubt that he was very good to his fans. But I can't just dismiss his behavior as "antics" and simply calling attention to himself. He 100% shunned Malcom X, whom he called a friend. He 100% mocked and degraded Frazier in front of children, at a charity event, in his home town.
These are not actions done to simply call attention to yourself, that can be done in many ways. The are done by an a$$h$#% who cares little about anyone else.
It's easy to act friendly when you are surrounded by people who adore you, are fans, and want to meet you. To me, how you act when you want something says more about your character than when you don't. And whenever Ali wanted something from someone, he acted like a dick.
Ya, I get it. We've all had moments of bad behavior in our younger days and Ali's was pretty bad. Let's face it, he was a d@@k in those days. It's not unusual for athletes to get in to another's head espeially when you have legendary rivals. Did you ever see it in your track and field days? I sure did but never let it bother me or act in kind. But I think he "grew" after he retired becoming a humanitarian, philanthropist and speaker. You can read more about this on his wiki page. Anyway, he was the most gracious personality I ever met and that's just my opinion of him. But I understand where you are coming from.
Ya, I get it. We've all had moments of bad behavior in our younger days and Ali's was pretty bad. Let's face it, he was a d@@k in those days. It's not unusual for athletes to get in to another's head espeially when you have legendary rivals. Did you ever see it in your track and field days? I sure did but never let it bother me or act in kind. But I think he "grew" after he retired becoming a humanitarian, philanthropist and speaker. You can read more about this on his wiki page. Anyway, he was the most gracious personality I ever met and that's just my opinion of him. But I understand where you are coming from.
Oh yeah I saw it, but not to that level. It was just completely over the top.
He may have changed, in fact I am sure he did but IMO sometimes bad behavior is just too bad to overlook or make up for.
I also know I am biased because I really like Frazier, and when I read the autobiography of Malcolm X, it did have a big effect on me. Lol... so if you respect those two it's hard to look at Ali objectively 🤣
@roaminglion I got the lead when me and 99 were going at it in politics lol
@roaminglion I got the lead when me and 99 were going at it in politics lol
Southern, it wouldn't be right to compare Pro's to Amateur posters. There should be an "All-Pro" designation for you.
