I agree with Joe. Sure, we dont know what Allar can do but we've all seen what Clifford can do and enough is enough. How will playing Allar hurt recruiting anymore than losing to OSU and Mich already has?? Once again we've managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. On the bright side of things, arent ya glad you're not a Pitt fan??
Yea it’s funny that these guys are worried that Allar might come in and turn the ball over when we have the 6th year big game turnover king starting for us already. OSU scored 24 points off of Clifford turnovers and it’s not going to get any worse than that.
Yeah. And most on here are convinced we're winning the last 4 but I'm not. If we do end 10-2 with a watered down NY-6 game there will be those thumping their chests and crowing about what a great season it was.
I agree with Joe. Sure, we dont know what Allar can do but we've all seen what Clifford can do and enough is enough. How will playing Allar hurt recruiting anymore than losing to OSU and Mich already has?? Once again we've managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. On the bright side of things, arent ya glad you're not a Pitt fan??
Yea it’s funny that these guys are worried that Allar might come in and turn the ball over when we have the 6th year big game turnover king starting for us already. OSU scored 24 points off of Clifford turnovers and it’s not going to get any worse than that.
Yeah. And most on here are convinced we're winning the last 4 but I'm not. If we do end 10-2 with a watered down NY-6 game there will be those thumping their chests and crowing about what a great season it was.
I think you are strawmanning that a bit. Southern is probably the most optimistic, positive guy in here and he wouldn't even be thumping his chest at that. He'd be happy at a good season, which 11-2 would be, but not over the moon with it.
I doubt anyone in here would strut because we finished 3rd in the East. However, you can still be happy with 11-2 AND want to get better. The two arent mutually exclusive.
@roaminglion because we can’t get in the playoffs and we lost to both Michigan and Ohio St imo we can’t have a great season. To have a great season we have to do one of the 3 but we can still have a good season which will help recruiting to try and get the QB to beat Ohio St and Michigan. Hopefully he’s on the team now we’ll have to wait till next year. I believe we’re Clemson today we just played 2 top 5 teams and they haven’t. Give Clemson the right QB and they’ll win NC’s but if they struggle at Qb they’ll lose 2 or 3 games just like we do. How good is your QB baby. Clemson is still Clemson, they just struggle at QB the last 2 years. Everybody is frustrated but the good news is we’re a QB away from competing for NC’s. We’ll finish probably around 6th. Y’all just just remember ole southern said it first baby lol
@roaminglion because we can’t get in the playoffs and we lost to both Michigan and Ohio St imo we can’t have a great season. To have a great season we have to do one of the 3 but we can still have a good season which will help recruiting to try and get the QB to beat Ohio St and Michigan. Hopefully he’s on the team now we’ll have to wait till next year. I believe we’re Clemson today we just played 2 top 5 teams and they haven’t. Give Clemson the right QB and they’ll win NC’s but if they struggle at Qb they’ll lose 2 or 3 games just like we do. How good is your QB baby. Clemson is still Clemson, they just struggle at QB the last 2 years. Everybody is frustrated but the good news is we’re a QB away from competing for NC’s. We’ll finish probably around 6th. Y’all just just remember ole southern said it first baby lol
You said it man, right on.
Anytime I get to watch PSU football it's a great season for me. Whether it can be considered great for the team is another issue altogether, lol.
The upside for Allar getting meaningful snaps with the first unit with games still on the line is that it will show how he reacts, what mistakes he makes and what he needs to work on. Why wait until the first few games next year to find out?
I agree with Joe, Hale, and Brownale. Why wait till next year? CS isnt afraid to throw a true freshman on the mat just to see how he'll do and its worked out OK for him. So for those that say "we cant start him cause he just a freshmen" I say bullshit!!!! What SPF said makes a lot of sense too. I wouldnt be surprised if we drop another game this year; Maryland and MSU could be tough. I say get his ass in there and if he makes mistakes, he'll learn from them. Looking at next year's schedule, we start out with WVA at home and then we have the mighty Delaware Hens to contend with. Those should be warm-up games for him but they're not going to prepare him for the more complicated defensive schemes he'll face later on.
Let me ask you guys this; how many of Cliff's team-mates have come out in support of him? I live here in SC and I can tell you that not many have his back.....and the right people are starting to get tired of JF's song and dance too. PSUJoe has a pretty good grasp on what's going on and he'll tell you the same thing.
Uncle BT, I respect the hell out of you and SPF but I have disagree with the "stay the course" strategy. We've been there and done that. It's time to prepare for next year and take our lumps if we have to.
If you don't use the best players available, isn't it kinda like throwing the game?
I'm not saying bench Clifford, let him start but play DA at least half the time. Build up as much game day tape as possible for DA to be analyzed in depth by both the coaching staff and DA over the next 9 month.
If everyone's goal is 10-2 seasons as a ceiling, then business as usual.
@thepakid PAkid my man it’s awesome seeing you back in here. I’m always for whoever gives us the best chance to win. I completely understand where y’all are coming from if we were 3-5 or even 4-4 but 11-2 is in our reach imo looking at the schedule. I’ve seen Allar play in a few games this year and imo he ain’t even close to being ready and really I don’t think he’s better than CV. 11 wins will keep recruiting on track and after 11-11 the last 2 years if we have another average year it could hurt recruiting and cost us a few recruits. James Franklin needs to show the 2023 class that it’s them that will get us over the hump on beating Ohio St and Michigan and if we go losing to Indiana and Michigan St they might jump ship plus James Franklin is paid 10 million dollars a year to win at least 10 or 11 games. Another 500 year Would be a downer for the team and fans and Penn St doesn’t want that. After the last 2 years it’s time to beat everybody we should beat and get this team playing with a chip on its shoulders. Finishing out the season 11-2 ranked 6th or 7th ain’t to bad and shows progress was made. Just the way I see it buddy
@rip I dont think Cliff is the best player. I've been able to observe a few practices. DA is ready to play. Think back a few years when it was Hack and Chase. Chase was ready to take over and should have taken over midway thru that season and Franklin wouldn't pull the trigger. He's gonna make the same mistake this year.
@southern-psu-fan: Ya really gotta see Allar in practice. I know, there are no champions on the practice field just as there are no champions in the wrestling room but this kid has "it". Remember how JF screwed the pooch and wouldnt play Chase even when Hack was stinking the place up?? Same thing Brother. Same darn thing.
@thepakid Nice to see ya back Kid! You've had the privilege of seeing a few practices, I have not. All I've seen of Allar is mop up, which doesn't really show you all that much. Yep, he can make some nice throws! Is he better than Cliffy? Could be. Maybe JF puts him in for a full 2nd half next game or as Joe speculates, may even start. Not totally against it, I'm just a bit more conservative and not real keen on change...unless I can see that it's going to improve things.
I doubt that DA will be traumatized by being "thrown to the wolves" as a true freshman. If he is then he is probably not going to lead PSU to the promised land. I think he will do just fine.
There is obviuosly a balance and JF is no dummy. I don't think he owes Cliff. He has had his chances but the team comes first. Long term winning helps recruiting so we should win out WHILE developing next years QB's.
Lots of people to keep happy with free agency.....
Top lineman don't leave if they only get 50% of the snaps.....
At the end of the day, Franklin and Yurcich are smarter football people and see more at Penn State practices than we do. Play Clifford.
At the end of the day, Franklin and Yurcich are smarter football people and see more at Penn State practices than we do. Play Clifford.
What the hell are you people afraid of ? Don’t you realize how great the rewards would be by starting and winning with Allar ? Win with Allar vs all these teams on the schedule that southern has told us all suck and all of a sudden PSU is one of the hottest teams in the country with a super Frosh QB. We’d be one of the most talked about teams in the offseason which then generates playoff talk and recruiting momentum. Win with Cliff and we’re nothing more than a team with questions heading into next season and will remain known as nothing more than a team that can’t hang with the big boys .
They talked about this today on 247 podcast
@southern-psu-fan: Ya really gotta see Allar in practice. I know, there are no champions on the practice field just as there are no champions in the wrestling room but this kid has "it". Remember how JF screwed the pooch and wouldnt play Chase even when Hack was stinking the place up?? Same thing Brother. Same darn thing.
I listen to a lot of podcasts from guys that sat in on preseason practices and a lot of them had claimed that Allar won the starting QB job.
I don't care if he's a freshman or not, but if he wasn't good enough or ready to start up to this point then I'd rather not start him at all. I'm not one who buys experience in games this year is going to matter... and wouldn't want to put someone in before they are ready.
That's all I'm saying, if he's the best player then by all means put him in. However, as I said if up to this point no one thought he was the best then why switch him out? For what, to throw in someone you thought wasn't ready because Clifford lost to #2 and #5? He's not going to suck, or have a bad start to next year just because he didn't play against Maryland and Michigan State. However, if he's not really ready for it (and some Freshman aren't) then what I'm saying is why throw him in?
At the end of the day it probably doesn't matter either way, I'm sure things will work out fine.
Clifford is burnt out. Period! He stayed too long and now it is really catching up to him. We have seen some glimpses of greatness here and there, but the kid just doesn't have the fire in is belly any more. The problem JF has now is, play Allar and you take a chance of losing 1 or 2 more games. Play Clifford and and your chance of winning out is much better. And that is strictly based on Clifford's knowledge and experience.
If Allar started the season, we may still be sitting at 2 and maybe 3 losses, but the experience would have paid off for next season. That didn't happen and they are now faced with a dilemma. What happens if you run with Allar (now) and he loses 2 or 3 games? What will that do to his confidence level? And what will it do the teams morale?
I think JF is stuck between a rock and hard spot. You almost have to stay with Clifford and hope he can find a second wind to finish out the season and get to a NY6 bowl game. I think winning the next 4 games is WAY more important than winning the bowl game. If Penn State loses to Indiana and/or Maryland, that will put this team in a bad place!
I am lost!! But GO STATE!!!!
Maybe I just got my eyes glued on 11-2 finishing 6th in the final rankings. I’m like BT, very conservative and stingy with gettin as many wins possible. I don’t think James Franklin owes Clifford anything he’s out there because Yurcich thinks he gives us the best chance to win. The players want to win as many games as possible I would think. I’ve watched Allar and I don’t believe he’s on the same playing field as Clifford today and I also don’t believe he’s better than CV. IMO I believe these next 5 games mean something to the players and they want to win and if you throw a QB out there that doesn’t give you the best chance to win and lose a few games to Indiana and Rutgers the players would be like WTF is this stupid coach doing. That would destroy team confidence. IMO james Franklin doesn’t owe Allar nothing except playing him if he gives us the best chance to win. K-Allen has taken over the #1 RB position and if Allar was better than Clifford today I believe he would be starting. IMO best players play especially when we can get 11 wins and a top 10 finish.
Guys, please don’t blame me I’m just a product of Weyman Sellers and the goat Joe Paterno baby, it’s their fault on how I think when it comes to football 😂
You just keep bringing it Southern!!! I am telling you, the TIDE is going to change and it will Penn States turn. I left that Ohio State game pssd off, but when I look back and consider the YOUNG talent all on that field ALL at one time, I have NO DOUBT this team will finish strong and be a force in 2023. I would predict a blow this Saturday, but knowing Cliff will probably start, they are just looking to get to a win and back home. I would think another conservative game to get a win and the bad taste out of their mouths and back home to take care of Maryland.....who will be ranked if they can get by Whisky this weekend.
GO STATE!!!
A lot of people assume that if we switch to Allar we'll win out anyway. Maybe. Consider this hypothetical possibility though. Suppose we go all in on Allar and we lose a game or 2. Doesn't that kinda take some of the luster off his being the one to take us to the promised land going into next year? This is another angle that needs to be considered. I still say, the safest bet is to stick with Cliff and get Allar (as well as CV) as many meaningful snaps with the first team as possible while keeping the goal of winning each game as the primary goal.
